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Personal journeys of New Zealand researchers
Personal journeys of New Zealand researchers
Listen to New Zealand researchers share their personal career journey and thoughts on what progress has been made to promote diversity and what more can be done.
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Dr Serean Adams, Aquaculture Group Manager, Cawthron Institute
Dr Serean Adams manages the Aquaculture Group at the Cawthron Institute, New Zealand's largest independent science organisation which offers a broad spectrum of services to help protect the environment and support sustainable development of primary industries.
Dr Serean Adams: Written interview
The Aquaculture group comprises over 50 scientists, technicians and support staff who lead research in a range of areas including selective breeding of multiple species, shellfish hatchery production, shellfish and finfish physiology, algae production, aquatic health, open ocean aquaculture and new species development. The Aquaculture Group works closely with the NZ aquaculture industry, and collaboratively with other NZ and international researchers to provide a practical multidisciplinary approach with science excellence to help realise aquaculture’s potential in NZ. Serean is also the leader of the Shellfish Aquaculture Research Programme which encompasses much of the group’s shellfish research and collaborations, as well as biosecurity and post-harvest research.
What did you study during undergraduate through to post-doctorate?
I studied at the University of Otago. I majored in zoology for my undergraduate degree and then went on to do a post-graduate diploma in Marine Science. I continued on to a PhD in Marine Science – my thesis investigated cryopreservation of gametes and larvae of the sea urchin, Evechinus chloroticus, and of other marine invertebrate species.
How did you make the transition into a fulltime research career?
My PhD was part of a larger research programme at Cawthron. Towards the end of my PhD, I helped Cawthron write a research proposal to secure further funding in this area. I went to the UK for a post doc and then came back to be part of that research programme.
How did you find the transition? Were there any barriers in the NZ science system which may have hindered your efforts- and anything which helped?
I think I was pretty lucky to be honest – I was fortunate that my PhD was part of a research programme which meant I was involved in applied research and writing competitive funding proposals right from the get go. Also, that the leader of the programme involved me and helped me continue in my career.
What progress have you seen to promote diversity in research careers? (This includes gender/ethnicity/ and career stage)
I’ve been really supported throughout my career at Cawthron, even during the years where I was part-time with young children I was able to progress, and I’ve seen other scientists similarly supported which is fantastic – life is not all about research. Cawthron has always had a diverse mix of people but that is more noticeable now with our growth – in my group there are 10 different nationalities. More recently, we’ve been able to take on some early career researchers and it has been exciting to see the enthusiasm, ideas and energy that these people bring to our group.
What would you like to see done to encourage and assist those currently studying, towards a research career?
I’d love to see more post-doctoral fellowships and early career grants for those that are studying to help provide a career pathway - I think these need to link in with larger research programmes to have impact. Also, talent and capability development deliverables within research programmes.
Associate Professor / Manukura Māui Hudson, University of Waikato
Assoc Prof Māui Hudson is a researcher and lecturer in the faculty for Maori and indigenous studies at the University of Waikato. Māui is an interdisciplinary researcher who focuses on the application of mātauranga Māori to decision-making across a range of contemporary contexts from new technologies to health, the environment to innovation.
Associate Professor / Manukura Māui Hudson: Written interview
What did you study during undergraduate through to postdoctorate?
I completed a BHSc in Physiotherapy at Auckland Institute of Technology in 1994. I went on to complete a MHSc in Healthcare Ethics in 2004.
How did you make the transition into a fulltime research career?
I initially had a Maori Development role at ESR focused primarily on business development. Over time I was involved in developing research projects that I could also be a part of in a research capacity. My initial research interests focused on traditional Maori healing, and the interface of mātauranga Maori, science, and biotechnology. When I moved to the University of Waikato I continued to split time between research projects and research development activities. Three years ago I moved into an academic role within Faculty of Maori and Indigenous Studies primarily doing research.
How did you find the transition? Were there any barriers in the NZ science system which may have hindered your efforts- and anything which helped?
I was fortunate that much of my early career has been in research offices where I was being funded to engage and connect with Maori communities and end-users. This provided an opportunity to develop relationships and networks that have supported future research projects. This also allowed me to circumvent some of the barriers in the NZ Science system, which make it hard to get funding for Maori related research projects.
What progress have you seen to promote diversity in research careers? (This includes gender/ethnicity/ and career stage)
The Vision Matauranga policy has been in place for over 10 years now and has recently become a more prominent part of the science system which creates more opportunities for Maori researchers to be included in collaborative research projects. While there has been an increasing amount of opportunities for Maori post graduate scholarships (Masters and PhD's) there have been limited opportunities for those graduates to gain post doctoral or full time research/academic positions.
What would you like to see done to encourage and assist those currently studying, towards a research career?
It would be great if there were more opportunities for internships and scholarships to attend workshops and conferences so that they get a better understanding about the research culture and ecosystem. More support for Maori specific science initiatives and workshops (like SING Aotearoa) and programmes like Puhoro STEM Academy are necessary to increase the interest of Maori in becoming researchers. More post doctoral opportunities and stability for early career researchers would also be valuable.
Dr Dan Hikuroa, Senior Lecturer, Māori Studies, University of Auckland
Dr Dan Hikuroa is a senior lecturer in Māori Studies Te Wānanga o Waipapa, University of Auckland, teaching a course on Tikanga and contributing to courses in natural hazards and disasters, and the Science Scholars programme in the Faculty of Science.
Dr Dan Hikuroa: Written interview
What did you study during undergraduate through to postdoctorate?
Bachelors of Science, majoring in Geology 1996
PG Diploma in Geology 1997
Doctor of Philosophy in Paleontology and Geology 2005
How did you make the transition into a fulltime research career?
I needed to stay on to do a Masters as I hadn’t quite focused enough during under-graduate study.
I got tricked into doing a PhD by being offered an amazing project leading a deep-field geology expedition for the British Antarctic Survey for which I described a suite of Jurassic rocks, the fauna therein, and contributed to understanding of the temporal and spatial nature of Gondwana break-up.
I was awarded Tuapapa Putaiao (Foundation for Research, Science & Technology) and Te Mata o te Tau Doctoral Scholarships, a Claude McCarthy Travel Fellowship and the Hornibrook Award (Geological Society of NZ).
During the PhD I taught two courses: Earth Science & Coastal Geomorphology and Management at Te Whare Wānanga o Awanuiārangi, during which I developed strong relationships with local Māori communities.
A University of Auckland Faculty of Science postdoctoral fellowship followed – for which I was a member of a 35 country, a 130 member strong International Geological Correlation Programme project, who along with James Crampton and Poul Schioler (both from GNS Science) formed the New Zealand contingent. We worked on rapid sea temperature increase, a consequence of natural climate change in the ancient past and its impact on productivity in the oceans.
Following the completion of the post-doctoral fellowship, in 2008 I was appointed as Community Earth Systems Science Programmes Manager as a foundation member of the Institute of Earth Science & Engineering (IESE), University of Auckland.
While working at the IESE I secured 2 research projects from Ngā Pae o te Māramatanga, one of the National Centres of Research Excellence (CORE). Through the successful completion of those projects I was asked to apply for, and was successful in attaining, the position of Research Director at Ngā Pae o te Māramatanga, where I worked for 6 years. After being part of the team that secured another CORE contract, worth ~$30 million, I transitioned out of Ngā Pae into a fixed-term roles in Anthropology (1 year) and Māori Studies (3 years) before securing a permanent in Māori Studies in 2018.
As I was looking for places to head after securing the Ngā Pae contract I applied for a number of ‘science’ positions but was unsuccessful. I was also encouraged to make a case for a Strategic Appointment, one that enjoyed the full support of a Science School, and the Dean of Science, and had no financial encumbrance’s as I was fully funded on research grants for a number of years. The case was declined, in part because of a mediocre publication record at that time, and in part because it was deemed I had no focus.
How did you find the transition? Were there any barriers in the NZ science system which may have hindered your efforts- and anything which helped?
The transition was not routine, but not unique either, and one I was comfortable with. However I find myself today in a role operating in a Faculty of Arts, yet practicing science and publishing in science journals, as well as others. I think a barrier I encountered was the siloed disciplinary approach thinking and preference that led to the ‘lack of focus’ criticism. I found that view interesting because the focus was very clear to me – every piece of research I had been involved in was either trying to realise the dreams of or help solve the challenges facing Māori communities.
Being awarded the Tuapapa Putaiao Scholarship certainly assisted.
What progress have you seen to promote diversity in research careers? (This includes gender/ethnicity/ and career stage)
In terms of gender equity there has been some improvement, although we still have ways to go. I believe, in particular, the work being done on unconscious bias is having positive results. With respect to cultural and ethnic diversity we have also made some improvement, but we also have a ways to go.
Māori are under-represented across the sciences. The implementation of the Vision Mātauranga Policy has had some positive outcomes. Furthermore strategic planning of job descriptions should result in an increase in Māori in the sciences.
I believe all scientists should read Professor Linda Tuhiwai Smith’s seminal De-Colonising Methodologies.
What would you like to see done to encourage and assist those currently studying, towards a research career?
Be honest about the challenges as well as the rewards and the rewarding nature of a research career.
As folks currently working in sciences, it is our responsibility to create space for the next generations, as outlined in Linda Tuhiwai Smith’s De-colonising Methodologies.
Promote diversity.
Link them to the Kindness in Science movement.
Dr Rebecca Jarvis, research fellow, Auckland University of Technology
Dr Rebecca Jarvis is an early career researcher, currently employed as a research fellow at Auckland University of Technology. She sat down with us to discuss the barriers she has faced as a woman in the science system and what it is like being in the early stages of her career.
Video Transcript
I'm Rebecca Jarvis, I am a research fellow at Auckland University of Technology and I study interdisciplinary conservation science and marine socioecological systems. So yeah, I study people in the environment basically how we can work better together for the future of the marine environment and make better decisions together and take better actions together.
I studied marine biology for my undergrad and then I switched to conservation management for my Master's then I went away to work for a few NGOs and a couple of different places and came back to study for my PhD a couple of years ago.
I have had some barriers yep I have had barriers as being a woman, whether that's not been listened to as much or as supported as others or sort of in the background a little bit, I think, but during my PhD I had a really strong supportive mentor who was also a woman and really understood what it was like to be a woman in science and that made a massive difference for me during my PhD.
Being an early career researcher is precarious and there is low job security so we're in a position now as research fellows and early careers where we trying to set up all this exciting research we'd like to do but maybe our contract ends in a year and we don't know what's going to happen after that.
I know that financial support and financial difficulty puts a lot of stress on people coming through their PhDs and really passionate about the research but worried about if they can make it and if they can finish it and all that sort of stuff so having scholarships to support people I think would be a very good move.
There are quite a few barriers in science and there are still even if you don't always hear about them. I think the best thing we can do as scientists is to find your humans and be there for each other because we're people first and together we can overcome those barriers.
Dr Arama Rata, Senior Research Fellow, National Institute of Demographic and Economic Analysis, University of Waikato
Dr Arama Rata is a Senior Research Fellow in the National Institute of Demographic and Economic Analysis at the University of Waikato. She has shared with us her journey in academia and her views on the barriers many Māori academics face.
Dr Arama Rata: Written interview
I te tuatahi, nei rā te mihi nunui ki a koutou. He uri tēnei nō Taranaki mounga. Ko Ngāruahine, ko Taranaki ngā iwi. Ko Titahi te hapū. Ko Ōeo, ko Orimupiko ngā marae. Ki te taha o tōku kuia, ko Ngāti Maniapoto te iwi. Ko Ngāti Rora te hapū. Ko Te Kohanganui-a-noho te marae. Ko Arama Rata tōku ingoa. Nō reira tēnā koutou katoa.
I am a Senior Research Fellow at NIDEA (the National Institute of Demographic and Economic Analysis), based at the University of Waikato. Broadly speaking, my research is about building connectedness within Māori communities and between Indigenous and migrant communities, using both quantitative and qualitative methods. I'm particularly interested in how settler colonial structures position racialised peoples and the impact this social positioning has on their lives.
What did you study during undergraduate through to postdoctorate?
I completed a BSc in Psychology and Applied Statistics, then went on to complete an honours degree and a PhD in Psychology. I also gained a lot of research, teaching and administrative experience while I was still a student. During that time, there seemed to be an expectation that students would fulfil certain roles for free, and I found myself working in many contexts (such as on committees and boards) where I was the only one not being paid. While these experiences were often beneficial, there were also instances where my generosity and love for my people was being exploited. Over time, I’ve come to realise this experience is common, particularly for students of colour. Looking back, when I was asked whether I would be willing to perform certain roles that I knew were not in my interests, I wish I understood that it would have been ok to have responded, “Is there a budget for that?”
How did you make the transition into a fulltime research career?
Being a Māori woman in the particular science department I studied in was so unsafe that I retreated to the shelter of a Māori Studies department for my first fulltime academic position. A new position in my field was then advertised in the science department, and I was encouraged to apply. But I was so relieved to be in an affirming environment at Māori studies, I was unwilling to give that up. Unfortunately, Māori women scientists are routinely faced with these types of choices, in which we have to decide between advancing our careers and our personal safety. While I’m now at an institute that is both affirming of my identity as a Māori woman and able to offer discipline specific support, this is not the case for many Māori women scientists.
How did you find the transition? Were there any barriers in the NZ science system which may have hindered your efforts - and anything which helped?
The science system, like other knowledge systems in New Zealand, is part of a broader society founded on racist and sexist social structures. Yet science is distinct from many other knowledge systems, in that it has been used explicitly to justify structural inequality, through scientific racism. As a Māori woman scientist, my efforts are hindered by the settler colonial logic that my people, our knowledge systems, and my sex are inferior. While there aren’t (usually) signs on the walls of universities proclaiming my inferiority, institutional policies and norms underpinned by these racist and sexist structures function to systematically disadvantage Māori women in the science system.
Although there are many initiatives across the system designed to counter disadvantage, in the university setting they are often designed to improve student outcomes and neglect staff development. In addition, these initiatives tend to be precarious, operating unfunded or on insecure funding.
What progress have you seen to promote diversity in research careers?
When I was at university, there was program for Māori science students in which senior students would mentor their juniors. The program created community, and helped many students to achieve. However, it now occurs to me how absurd that is, as a model: to attempt to improve Māori outcomes by burdening senior Māori students with the responsibility of mentoring their juniors. I’m not saying these programs don’t lift first year achievement, because they absolutely can and do. But equitable outcomes for Māori students should be the core business of the university, and should therefore be funded. Senior Māori students should continue to be given opportunities to mentor junior students where needed, but like all other key staff in the university they should be paid to do so. Unfortunately these programs are often all that are offered in terms of supporting Māori into science research careers, and students coming through the system today are still jumping the same hurdles I had to a decade ago.
Since beginning my science journey, I have witnessed some positive changes within organisations that fund and promote science (for example, the integration of Vision Mātauranga into the research investment approach taken by MBIE, and recognition of the Treaty of Waitangi in Te Apārangi - The Royal Society of New Zealand's Code of Professional Standards and Ethics in Science, Technology, and the Humanities). However, it’s taking time for these changes to translate into smoother education pathways for emerging Māori scientists at the tertiary level. And these types of changes are not enough.
What would you like to see done to encourage and assist those currently studying, towards a research career?
Structural changes are needed to decolonise science teaching, research, and funding. Māori must have full control over a kaupapa Māori science system. I see huge potential in the transformative effect of kaupapa Māori science education, and look with particular interest to the recently established Pūhoro STEM Academy to create pathways for emerging Māori scientists, as a first step. These young scientists are now entering universities across the country, but the science system is not ready for them. We must respond quickly and radically to enable these students to reach their full potential not just as scientists but as Māori scientists.
Dr Siân Halcrow, Associate Professor of Biological Anthropology at the University of Otago
Siân Halcrow works in the Department of Anatomy at the University of Otago. Read about how she transitioned into a full-time academic career and her thoughts on what we should do to encourage more diversity in science and academia.
Dr Siân Halcrow: Written interview
I am currently an Associate Professor of Biological Anthropology and technically still an Early Career Researcher (in years post PhD), in the Department of Anatomy at the University of Otago. I am a bioarchaeologist, so I study human skeletons from archaeological sites to answer central questions about human society, health and the environment.
What did you study during undergraduate through to postdoctorate?
I studied a Bachelor of Arts (Honours) in Anthropology starting at the University of Auckland and then moved to the University of Otago for my third year, then focused on Archaeology and Biological Anthropology for my honours year. After that I did a PhD in the Biological Anthropology at the Department of Anatomy at the University of Otago.
How did you make the transition into a fulltime research career?
I was supported by my PhD supervisor into a Postdoc continuing my work in SE Asian bioarchaeology. I then attained 2 consecutive, 2-year Postdocs in my department, and then gained a lectureship in 2010. (Although researchers are often recognised for their research, that isn’t the only part of my jobs; I teach and convene undergraduate and postgraduate courses, and contribute to service at the department, university, and national and international bodies).
How did you find the transition? Were there any barriers in the NZ science system which may have hindered your efforts and anything which helped?
The transition was ok in terms of the research and teaching I had to undertake. I always taught during my PhD and postdoctoral career and also learned a lot about grant writing during my postgraduate and postdoctorate time. I had my first child as a PhD student which was challenging and she was young when I started my Postdoc. My mentor and HoD understood the challenges of juggling motherhood and research which really helped. I had my second child in 2014 as a senior lecturer. I found the transition back to work after 3 months leave was quite difficult with breastfeeding and childcare etc. (I couldn’t afford to take any more leave.) I was also landed with a very intense teaching load and convening 3 papers.
Durham University in the UK has set up a great initiative where women and men returning to work after parental leave have 6 months research and study leave. This is so important for supporting researchers who have been away to climb back on the ladder to where they would have been had they not had this leave. I talk about some of these issues on the Childhood Bioarchaeology site(external link).
What progress have you seen to promote diversity in research careers? (This includes gender/ethnicity/ and career stage.)
We have made some progress, but still have a long way to go in terms of gender equity in science in NZ. I was dismayed that the Royal Society decided not to adopt the Athena SWAN Charter. Although I understand their concerns, these are actually met by the Charter’s structure itself. However, this year the Royal Society has set up Te Kauhuahua, an advisory group considering equity and diversity and the Royal Society also has a Diversity Policy.
Some of the international conferences that I attend have childcare provided. A great example is the American Association of Physical Anthropology which provides free childcare at their conference venues. Childcare is a gender issue as caregiving mahi is mostly undertaken by women and is a real barrier for attendance at conferences, especially international conferences. I have talked about this on my blog(external link).
The University of Otago has updated its Māori Strategic Framework 2020 which is used to guide our mahi to support the development of strong Māori-focused research projects, teams and opportunities with an emphasis on outcomes that have a positive effect for Māori.
I am a past co-convenor of the University of Otago Ozone Research Group. It comprises top early career researchers at the university and aims to promote and support Early Career Researchers (ECRs).
The Royal Society Early Career Research Forum is active in supporting the development of ECRs across all areas of research in New Zealand, and I was honoured to be a founding committee member. This Forum represents the national voice of New Zealand’s ECR community and to celebrate their contributions in the fields of physical, biological and social sciences, as well as the humanities. One of the focuses of the forum is gender and equity.
What would you like to see done to encourage and assist those currently studying, towards a research career?
There should be flexible work hours for parents and more recognition of the other barriers for academic mothers (for example, I did not realise that I could apply for funding so my dependents could travel with me for my sabbatical until 3 years after my research leave). There needs to be breastfeeding rooms and storage fridges provided to staff, and universities should consider extending paid parental leave to be on par with the government leave. Currently, my understanding is that the University of Otago provides the shortest length of paid parental leave out of all of the universities in NZ.
We need to encourage Māori and Pacific researchers and research at our universities, and put more strategic funding into supporting this research. How many times have you heard an excuse for all male panels (#manels) being that there were no women available? Make these opportunities work for women by providing support for them to attend.
I think unconscious bias is still a real issue in academia and science. Everyone should do unconscious bias training.
Dr Anne-Marie Jackson, Senior Lecturer of Māori physical education and health at the University of Otago
Anne-Marie Jackson is a Māori academic, early career researcher and Senior Lecturer at the University of Otago in the School of Physical Education, Sport and Exercise Sciences. She is passionate about the work that she does and has shared her journey with us.
Anne-Marie Jackson: Written interview
I am a Senior Lecturer of Māori physical education and health where I teach undergraduate and postgraduate curriculum in Māori physical education and health at the School of Physical Education, Sport and Exercise Sciences. I am an Associate Dean with a focus on External Engagement for my School. I have always been passionate about physical education as it is the blend of science and humanities where you have the opportunity to put theory into practice in the context of mauri ora or flourishing wellness.
My research area is Māori physical education and health which is the study and application of Māori worldview, Te Tiriti o Waitangi and Kaupapa Māori Theory within a physical education and health context.
I have the privilege of working with Māori communities to support their aspirations. My current focus is across 4 areas:
- Māori physical education and health
- Tangaora/marine
- waka and water safety
- indigenous science.
These are underpinned by my praxis and these are the threads that are a feature of all of the my research:
- community engagement and co-production
- Kaupapa Māori methodology
- Kaupapa Māori methods, namely hui and wānanga
- graduate student development.
I co-lead 2 research groups: Te Koronga(external link) and Te Tiaki Mahinga Kai(external link). Te Koronga is a Māori research excellence kaupapa comprised of 2 parts:
- our graduate research excellence students and
- the indigenous science research theme.
Our moemoeā is mauri ora or flourishing wellness and our kaupapa is Māori research excellence based on the aspirations of Māori communities underpinned by a Kaupapa Māori ethos. Te Koronga is our intentional approach to grow Māori researchers through undergraduate, to postgraduate and into academic careers. The indigenous science research theme is focused on emerging and established researchers who work alongside Māori communities in:
- mātauranga derived research
- interface work
- research that has a decolonising ethos or where it is of a non-Māori focus but Māori have an interest in.
Te Tiaki Mahinga Kai is a research group that aims to enhance customary fisheries management. We work with local Māori communities to support their aspirations to strengthen the connections to the marine environment through managing resources and places of importance.
What did you study during undergraduate through to postdoctorate?
In my undergraduate I studied a Bachelor of Physical Education majoring in Exercise Sport Science with honours in Professional Studies. I studied a Master of Physical Education and then a PhD in physical education and Māori studies.
I have always been interested in the sciences, arts and practical applications for wellbeing and so physical education is the ideal fit for me to explore these things. Physical education gives you a grounding in seeing the world from cell to society which is becoming more important in the world that we live in today.
How did you make the transition into a fulltime research career?
At the end of my PhD, a tenure track academic position became available at the School of Physical Education, Sport and Exercise Sciences. I applied and was successful for that job – which I am still in now.
How did you find the transition? Were there any barriers in the NZ science system which may have hindered your efforts- and anything which helped?
There were a number of challenges I faced, and continue to face as an emerging researcher. There are many transitions ie, undergrad to postgrad, PhD student to academic, lecturer to senior lecturer and so on. I face the normal challenges of other new academics ie publish v perish, balancing research, teaching and service, learning “the game”, building a research platform etc.
In addition to these are the challenges of being a Māori academic and what that brings. For me, being young (relatively), Māori and female can be quite difficult in the science system. Each of these identities bring their own challenges and when combined these difficulties are exacerbated.
I am fortunate in that I haven’t been worn down by the science system yet. I haven’t been worn down as I have my touch stones in the communities and research groups I work with. They give me the perspective needed to ensure that we can continue to deliver on work that is meaningful and necessary. Working with communities is not easy and it brings a different set of challenges, but for the type of research we undertake communities are a critical part to ensure we are tika (correct) and pono (honest) in what we are doing.
What progress have you seen to promote diversity in research careers? (This includes gender/ethnicity/ and career stage.)
There is an increased recognition in the promotion of diversity in science and research, however, I have seen few examples where these have translated to genuine increases in diversity at an institutional level – and I am referring primarily to Māori staff; as well as researchers who may be non-Māori but have excellent expertise in working with and alongside Māori.
What would you like to see done to encourage and assist those currently studying, towards a research career?
For the individual researcher, it sounds cliché, but I firmly believe it, and am an example of it, to work and study in an area that you are passionate about. I have been reflecting a lot this year, how fortunate I am to have made a career out of studying and researching on areas I love, while being able to serve my communities.
For emerging Māori researchers, ground yourself in your own ways of understanding the world first, always listen to your whānau and communities and it’s important to follow through in actions.
In terms of what can be done to encourage those towards a research career – we are at a crisis point in the science system in Aotearoa where there is limited increase in the number of Māori academic positions, as such, what I would like see done is a national policy with associated resourcing that is intentionally focused on Māori academic positions focused on kaupapa Māori in sciences to population parity.
Professor Kate McGrath, Deputy Vice-Chancellor and Vice-President (Research) at Sydney University of Technology
Before her current role, Pofessor Kate McGrath held the position of Vice-Provost (Research) at Victoria University of Wellington, and previously was the Director of the McDiarmid Institute.
Professor Kate McGrath: Written interview
I am currently the Deputy Vice-Chancellor and Vice-President (Research). This role is the lead role in a university responsible for all research within the university, from strategy to operational, from mandatory reporting to strategic intelligence analysis. I get to know about all the research that is happening in the university and work with researchers to help them realise their research ambitions.
What did you study during undergraduate through to postdoctorate?
As an undergraduate I did a four-year BSc(Hons) degree with a major in Chemistry. I also did a lot of Math and Physics in my undergraduate. In my PhD I worked in molecular self-assembly, a then quite young subject but now explored and utilised in a wide array of research areas and commercial processes. The study of systems that undergo self-assembly to form a multitude of different structures is often thought of sitting in physical chemistry, biophysics or chemical engineering. This became my major research area and so were what I did in my two postdoctoral fellow positions as well.
How did you make the transition into a fulltime research career?
After my PhD and the two postdoctoral fellowships, I became an academic and being a researcher was a fundamental part of that role, so it was a natural growth to become a lead researcher after 6-7 years of training.
How did you find the transition? Were there any barriers in the NZ science system which may have hindered your efforts- and anything which helped?
I began my academic career in the late 1990s and things were different, there weren’t grants for people just starting out, you had to compete along with everyone else, but I was fortunate to get a couple of Marsdens early and of course that helped enormously to establish my research career. The system is enormously different now than when I started. Being an academic is vastly different as well. I think there is a greater expectation and much higher entry level into academia and being able to be successful in the system.
What progress have you seen to promote diversity in research careers? (This includes gender/ethnicity/ and career stage)
The system and different institutions now recognise and support people who are just starting out and so there are many different opportunities to help people get started. There are also many different flexibilities built into the system to allow the system to be a more inclusive environment. But I think that research and research institutions, including universities are still not as inclusive as is necessary. Considerable focus in recruitment, the environment, the expectations, and the work hours need to continue to create fuller inclusion.
What would you like to see done to encourage and assist those currently studying, towards a research career?
I think that there needs to be a much greater visibility and understanding of just how broad a research career can be. There is still too much traditional context surrounding and setting the structure of the teaching and this fundamentally needs to change.
Dr Margaret Hyland: Vice-Provost (Research) Victoria University of Wellington
Until recently, Dr Margaret Hyland was our chief science advisor from 2017 to July 2018 and a lecturer at the University of Auckland’s Faculty of Engineering. Hear Margaret talk about her experience in the New Zealand Science System and how she made the transition from studying a PhD to her career today. Margaret also shares her thoughts what is being done to encourage diversity in the science system and what we should focus on going forward.
Video Transcript
I’m Margaret Hyland, I’m Chief Scientist at the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment. And I’m also an academic at the University of Auckland in the faculty of engineering.
After I finished my PhD, I applied for a range of post-doc positions. Within a couple of years, of being in that post-doc position a new lectureship came open, and I applied for that lectureship and got that lectureship.
One of the common things that women going into an academic career often think about is how you manage a family. It’s often thought of as something that works against you if you have a career, where it really adds to your career. So I learned a lot about how to manage people, how to manage expectations, how to stick to my guns about something. A lot of skills that have since that time really helped, in my career.
[MBIE asks “Where do you see progress being made to encourage diversity in science?”]
What’s good is that we’re recognising that diversity is really important. That a diverse range of views from people with different backgrounds different nationalities, men and women, you know as much diversity as we can get. That adds to whatever organisation or whatever activity you’re doing. So it’s great that we’re now acknowledging that, that there’s a real advantage to it.
I think it’s important that we make a distinction between diversity and equity. Diversity is making sure that our organisations do include a range of different people, different views, different backgrounds. Equity is where we need to be very purposeful about inclusion for groups where they may not have had the same opportunities to be included. And if we think about in our science system - where we’ve got evidence there women are really under represented, but also maori and pasifika. For a lot of structural reasons and other reasons they don’t necessarily have the same opportunities to contribute to the science system to be active researchers and therefore we do need to think particularly about those three groups and how we address the inequities there.
But the delivering on that is a lot harder. And inherent bias is one of those things that we just can’t get past. We have inherent bias when we make decisions about who to hire, about who to promote, in universities about who gets to go on academic leave, about who we’re going to fund, about who wins awards or prizes or fellowships. And although there might not be a huge bias each time, it accumulates.
[MBIE asks “What can Organisations like MBIE do to encourage more diversity?”]
I think MBIE as a funder has a really important role and I think MBIE as an employer or other employers have very important roles. I mean they’re big decision makers. Having role models is one, where if you can see people in that role who look like you, then you realise that you can do this thing. If we do that then it opens it up for a lot of other people as well.
Dr Lucy Stewart, Marine Microbiologist, GNS Science
Dr Lucy Stewart is an early career researcher and a Marine Microbiologist at GNS Science, She is also a member of the early career research forum hosted by the Royal Society.
Hear Lucy talk about her current research, how she made the transition from studying her PhD, to a full-time career in research science and what further support she feels is needed to increase diversity in New Zealand’s science system.
Video Transcript
My name is Lucy Stewart; I’m a marine microbiologist at GNS Science. At undergraduate, I went to the University of Canterbury and I did a BSc Honours in biology and I then went overseas to the US to the University of Massachusetts Amherst and I did a PhD in microbiology.
My work during my PhD studies was mostly looking at the microbiology of deep-sea hydrothermal vents. So there’s are environments where because of volcanism at the bottom of the ocean, you get hot water coming out and it creates environments where special kinds of microbes live, which I studied, and I then approached someone in New Zealand about writing a post-doctoral fellowship proposal for funding for two years – to look at some hydrothermal vents which are located to the north of New Zealand and also hot springs and the microbes that grow in them, in some islands to the north of New Zealand. So the Kermadec Islands, Raoul Island and Curtis Island.
So I came to GNS with that funding for two years and then while I was at GNS I got involved with another proposal to study the microbiology of still the deep sea, but this time microbes that live in methane seeps, which where methane naturally seeps out of the ocean, and there’s microbes that eat it. And there’s proposals to mine that methane, and so I’m looking at if we did do that – what would the environmental impacts be on both the microbes that live in these areas but then the wider ecology that actually depends on microbes to provide energy for them.
[MBIE asks “What barriers did you encounter when making the transition to a research career?”]
I came to university knowing I wanted to do research science, so I was quite focused on that goal. The big problem really, both in going to the US and then coming back to New Zealand, have been the big problem for everyone which is finding funding. So to go to the US, I could only afford to do that for a PhD if it was going to be a university with a fully funded program and there are not that many of them. It’s like any job really, where you can get the job defines where you can go. And coming back to New Zealand, I was again very lucky – I got a Rutherford Post-Doctoral fellowship. They offered seven in the year I got one; normally it’s more like five. It used to be they offered a hundred a year, in New Zealand and that was the primary source, and now there’s five. So if I hadn’t got that I probably would’ve left science, just because of the limited opportunities to do the kind of work I do.
If you did your PhD in New Zealand, you really have to go overseas to do post-doc so that hugely changes the way New Zealanders do science because they are basically obliged to go overseas to get jobs and experience before they’re qualified for jobs here. And this wasn’t a problem for me, I was very lucky, but particularly for people who have family obligations or disabilities that mean it’s very difficult for them to go overseas, that’s a huge barrier.
At the University level, women are now most students. So we had about 75% female PhD students in my programme, there were only three female professors out of about fifteen in the faculty and all of them had had children in their forties, essentially because they couldn’t take time off to have kids before they had permanent jobs which they’d finally had at the university they were at.
There is a persistent drop off as people progress through their careers. And I think this is, it’s due to the same reasons that women face issues in other careers, it’s made very hard for them to integrate family life and work life.
[MBIE asks “What progress do you think there has been to promote diversity?”]
While it’s improved a lot since the mid-twentieth century, a lot of areas of academia – the people who run it are the older people who have a lot of publications. And so there’s kind of a self- perpetuating cycle where some of them are great, and some of them they pick people to mentor who look and are like them, they promote the peers of people who are like them, and so women keep coming in and trying for a few years and going – you know what I can’t be bother being the person who has to break the cycle, it’s too much work, and moving into other careers.
The places where its worked successfully and I have seen them are places where they pro-actively recruit more than one woman and more than one person of colour and give people communities. Because being the only black professor, or the only Maori professor, or the only woman on the staff is really tough.
[MBIE asks “What would you like to see to encourage more diversity in Science?”]
Ultimately in New Zealand, we just need more money in research, if we’re going to have more people in research; we have to have more money. Both institutions and academia have to pro-actively work to change the balance if they think they don’t have enough diversity. They cannot rely on merit. They have to go out there say our goal is to hire women; our goal is we’re going to hire Maori researchers.
Dr Kelly Dombroski, Senior Lecturer at University of Canterbury, College of Science
Dr Kelly Dombroski is a senior lecturer in the college of sciences at the University of Canterbury. We caught up with Kelly to ask about her journey from studying a PhD to working in the science and research workforce. You can watch Kelly talk about her experience and what she recommends to help early career researchers make the transition into the workforce.
Video Transcript
Kia Ora, My name is Kelly Dombroski and I’m currently at the University of Canterbury. I did my undergraduate degree in environmental studies, a bachelor of arts in environmental studies at Massey University, and then I did a Masters in Philosophy in development studies and then I did a PhD in Geography starting at the Australian National University, transitioning to western Sydney University. When my supervisor moved universities, I went with her. My first job was as a lecturer in geography at Macquarie University in Sydney and I hadn’t finished my PhD.
[MBIE asks “Did you encounter any barriers in your transition to a full time research career?”]
So I had two children during my PhD and my third child, I got pregnant with my third child while I was working at Macquarie University and I actually applied for my job at University of Canterbury while I was about this pregnant. Some people perceive it as being a barrier so you really have to perform yourself as being super, super competent in order to try and convince people that you can do the job. So on top of that barrier is the barrier of inadequate maternity leave. So as a PhD student, my first baby, I got no maternity leave so I had to keep studying, and then with my second I was entitled to three months maternity leave but employers or funders sometimes would judge the fact that I was a mother of a young baby as being that I wasn’t capable of being able to do what I said I would do.
Well you know I keep saying I would rather take on a mother PhD student than anyone else cause they might only have four hours on campus but they get it all done in four hours and they’re not mucking around on Facebook or anything.
I think what I found really difficult was that most of my research was in China and when I only had one child I would just take her with me. Once we got up to three children it’s too expensive to do that, and also they’re in school and stuff, so I found it was a really big transition for me to actually try and find a research topic I could do in New Zealand despite having all my research experience in China.
[MBIE asks “What progress have you seen to promote more diversity in the scientific workforce?”]
It was really good coming back to New Zealand from Australia and seeing the progress that’s been made around trying to be a bi-cultural society I think what could be done more for funding in terms of diversity is mentoring around those funding strategies. I find a lot of my male colleagues have very good mentors in research and innovation or they know a lot of older men who have had a lot of grants and they get that kind of mentoring around the beers after work or something like that. Whereas I think, especially for those of us with very young children, you don’t get that – I mean you’re in there for the four hours and you do the work and then you go home.
I think in New Zealand we think we’re very fair but often we’re not and I think we need to make a bit more of an effort to make sure that we have a diverse range of people coming into research. It’s really difficult for PhD students, especially coming from overseas. I’ve got nine PhD students and eight of them are from overseas. And when they look at who got the latest grants or who got the latest Rutherford or who got MBIE grants they don’t see people who look like them getting grants. It’s not so much about advise for those people but what we can do to support younger people coming through and I think that’s partly again trying to mentor and come alongside people. Include them on your publications co-write with them and you know when you’re putting in a grant application think about who else can you include.
You often need to include some professor to get it noticed, but who else can you bring along behind you to include in that. None of this kind of care work is part of your job description right, so you don’t have to do it officially and people aren’t allowed to ask you for it officially but there’s no way that we can change the face of science without having this kind of mentoring relationships and collectives of people helping each other.
Dr Gradon Diprose, Senior Lecturer at Massey University in the School of People, Environment and Planning
Dr Gradon Diprose is an early career researcher and Senior Lecturer at Massey University in the School of People, Environment and Planning. We caught up with Gradon and asked him to share his journey with us.
Gradon Diprose: Written interview
What is your current position, and what are you researching?
I’m currently employed by Massey University as a Senior Lecturer in the School of People, Environment and Planning. I coordinate a course called Tū Tira Mai: Practicing Engagement on active citizenship. In terms of research I’m currently working on three projects. The first is with Dr Louise Lee (Open Polytechnic) and Kaibosh(external link), a food rescue organisation in Wellington. The second is with Dr Kelly Dombroski (University of Canterbury), Associate Professor David Conradson (University of Canterbury) and Dr Stephen Healy (Western Sydney University), and Cultivate(external link), an urban farm/social enterprise in Christchurch. This project is funded by the Building Better Homes, Towns and Cities National Science Challenge. The third is a larger collaborative project on climate adaptive communities with colleagues from GNS Science, Victoria University, University of Otago and Landcare Research. This project is funded by the Deep South National Science Challenge.
What did you study during undergraduate through to post doctorate?
I studied a Bachelor of Social Sciences, majoring in Geography and Resource and Environment Planning at the University of Waikato. I then did a Masters in Geography from the University of Otago, and completed my PhD in Geography at Victoria University.
How did you make the transition into a fulltime research career?
I wouldn’t say I have a full time research career at the moment, as a significant amount of my time is spent on teaching and service. My working career has involved a range of jobs, from retail, community libraries, adjunct teaching and tutoring to working in local government as a planner. While completing my PhD in 2012 I got a part time job at the Open Polytechnic teaching social sciences in their BA programme. This was my first waged job that involved a research component (0.1 FTE). This year I shifted from the Open Polytechnic to Massey University and one of the things I am appreciating is the extra time and resources that I have for research now that I’m based at a university.
How did you find the transition? Were there any barriers in the NZ science system which may have hindered your efforts and anything which helped?
My transition to research related jobs has been relatively slow and characterised by temporary and part time contracts. Every job I’ve ever had since leaving planning in local government has started as a fixed term temporary contract. While there are a number of reasons for this (the nature of funding grants, changes in the tertiary sector etc), I’ve found that this uncertainty (or what some call the ‘gig economy’) makes it difficult to manage commitments when doing collaborative research. If I don’t know where I’m going to be next year, it can make it tricky to manage workload and future planning. What has helped is support from friends and colleagues (such as putting funding grants together and drawing on the research resources at our respective institutions), and also understanding managers who have enabled me to focus on research and recognised this as valuable.
What progress have you seen to promote diversity in research careers, including gender/ethnicity/ and career stage?
Good question! The stuff I’m aware of, or have been involved in includes things like eSocSci which has an Early Career and Postgraduate Network(external link) that does useful stuff. The new President of the Royal Society Te Apāirangi, Professor Wendy Larner, has made early career researchers a priority as part of a wider focus on diversity. The Royal Society Early Career Researcher Forum(external link) are currently doing a nationwide survey to try and gain a better understanding of issues facing early career researcher across New Zealand (and not just in tertiary institutions). I’ve also been involved in Tertiary Education Union Rainbow Te Kahukura(external link) events which focus on making workplaces and communities places that celebrate diversity, especially for lesbian, gay, bisexual, takatāpui, fa’afafine, transgender and intersex folks. As a gay person working in the research and the tertiary education sector I’ve found these kinds of networks really helpful in reminding me that there are other gender and sexually diverse folks around, and that we often have to navigate issues that straight people wouldn’t necessarily think about (such as interactions with research participants, how much personal information we share and who it is safe to ‘come out’ too). What these kinds of initiatives suggest to me is that concerns about diversity are starting to shift from talk to action.
What would you like to see done to encourage and assist those currently studying, towards a research career?
I’m heartened by the networks and work I described above. But I would love to see more Pasifika and Māori people moving into research careers. I’m no expert on how we create more welcoming and diverse research cultures, but I think part of it involves re-thinking quite a bit of everyday relational dynamics. I’ve been in research meetings where some pākehā (myself included) want to get ‘straight down to business’, and don’t allow enough time for genuine whanaungatanga. As a gay person I also know that feeling of being the ‘only one like you’ in a certain context which can feel quite isolating. So maybe one idea could be to have more focused cohort based postgraduate study for those students that feel safer as part of a learning community that has lots of people like them.
Dr Barbara Anderson, project coordinator for the Ahi Pepe MothNet project
Dr Barbara Anderson is the project coordinator for the Ahi Pepe MothNet project and an Unlocking Curious Minds Ambassador.
Listen to Barbara speak about her background, the barriers she has faced in the science system and her views on diversity in the science system.
Video Transcript
I'm Dr Barbara Anderson I'm the project coordinator for the Ahi Pepe MothNet project and I'm an Unlocking Curious Minds Ambassador, and by trade I am a quantitative ecologist.
So I actually trained at the University of Otago and I have a degree in botany an honours degree and then I have a PhD in botany and then I did eight years of post docs in the UK and Australia and then I came back to New Zealand as a Rutherford Discovery Fellow.
I think there's lots of barriers and I think the biggest barriers that affect everyone are the small everyday barriers. I don't think that there are any females in science who haven't experienced some degree of bias. The thing that often gets missed is that sort of sexism and science it's actually everyone's sexist it's the society that sexist.
We need to understand that not taking sides is actually taking the side of the aggressive partner and by rewarding bad behaviour we allow that to keep existing especially in science and I think science is a very aggressive it's a very aggressive career choice.
I don't know what the answer is but I think we as a group need to come up with a better answer. Here I would really talk to the senior females who maybe think we had it much harder and it's much easier now, one of these people, that's not the way that we move forward we have to make sure that as we move up even though it's becoming harder for us we still have to try and and keep making things better.
Dr Victoria Metcalf, National Coordinator of the Participatory Science Platform
Dr Victoria Metcalf currently works in the Office of the Prime Minister’s Chief Science Advisor as the National Coordinator of the Participatory Science Platform.
Listen to Victoria speak about her background, the barriers she faced when she was studying for her PhD and what she believes we need to do to improve diversity in the science system.
Video Transcript
My name is Victoria Metcalf and my current role has the longest job title in the world I think, it's National Coordinator of the Participatory Science Platform, in the Office of the Prime Minister's Chief Science Advisor.
In terms of my background what I did was I loved science and the arts particularly English and Latin at school but when I went off to university I decided to focus on science and I absolutely fell in love with what was inside cells and biochemistry and genetics in my first year. So I specialized in biochemistry honours in my undergraduate degree and then I decided that I wanted to keep researching and studying and so I decided to do a PhD in biochemistry.
I was always really passionate about science but I'll be upfront that there have been a lot of challenges along the way in my career. Even back to my earliest sort of research experience and doing my honours year and biochemistry I wasn't given a choice of supervisors and projects to work on. I was a top equal student in the class and the other top equal student who was a man got his first pick to work with a rock star of the department. Instead I was told that I had to work with a new academic but the reason was that I was asked to nurture and support the other two students that academic was going to be having.
Things that helped me were firstly my tenacity and my stubbornness to keep going even if I didn’t see role models ahead of me that looked like me – I’m pretty tenacious so I kept pushing through. Secondly was having the support of people around me eventually and then people just advocating for me whether I knew about it or not so maybe putting me forward for opportunities.
I think the science system has changed but I also think that fundamentally we might not be making our students who are beginning that progression through the sciences aware that there is such a diversity of roles within the sciences.
So first and foremost I think we need to ensure that we’re communicating why diversity matters and how it’s going to lead to a better economy, greater innovation, great research ideas because you have that diversity of opinion and thinking. There’s a strong need for top-down approaches and systems in place to actually change the system, to make it supportive and inclusive for everyone that wants to get involved in science which should be touchpoints, people from every sector of society.